Think Different Theory

How to Scale $62 Billion Worth of Business


In the episode, I sit down with business legend, David Finkel, the Founder and CEO of Maui Mastermind. David has helped over 100,000 Maui Mastermind clients buy, build, and sell billions of dollars of business assets. An ex-Olympic-level athlete turned business multi-millionaire, David is an American success story.


He has scaled over $60+ Billion dollars in businesses. He’s a master at systems, has co-authored some great books including the recent “The Freedom Formula”, and is one of America’s most respected business thinkers. He comes on to talk about family, freedom, business scaling, business advice, and more! This is a CAN’T-MISS EPISODE.

Here are the key topics discussed in this episode:

  • A master at building businesses (02:01)
  • A family man and managing $60 billion worth of scaling and building businesses (04:33)
  • Overcoming the sense of not being enough (10:18)
  • A little bit of humility is good for all of us (14:44)
  • How travel helps in figuring out problems (23:01)
  • Building an owner-independent company (33:39)
  • What to do with your time when you have an owner-independent company (41:59)
  • The investments after making a lot of money (51:52)


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September 11th, 2019


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Disclaimer: The Transcript Is Auto-Generated And May Contain Spelling And Grammar Errors

David: 00:00:00 We’re going to build… the 60 billion of companies I had a hand in, that doesn’t need us over the course of three years, before I sold my half of the business, that’s what we did, in a meeting we had in Estes Park, Colorado. And, so that was probably my first wave of learning how to build a company independently. And after we started doing that, what I realized was, the biggest challenge was me. I’m a control freak. I don’t know about you, Josh, but…

Josh: 00:00:19 Man.

David: 00:00:19 I hate feeling helpless and not being able to change it. And so, by me micromanaging everything, it became, I was the biggest bottleneck and stumbling point for the companies I was building.

Intro: 00:00:32 You are now entering a new paradigm. So, here’s my issue. I wanted to find the answers to life’s biggest questions. Things like, how do I become happy and live with purpose? How do I make more money doing what I love, and what does it mean to be truly successful in all areas of life? My name is Josh Forti, @JoshForti on Instagram, and I ask life’s biggest questions and share the answers with you. My goal is to help you find purpose, happiness, and open your mind to new realms of possibility by helping you think differently about everything you do, know, and understand. On this podcast, we think different, we dream bigger, and we live in a world without limits. This is a new paradigm. Welcome to The Think Different Theory.

Josh: 00:01:17 What’s up guys? Welcome back to another episode of The Think Different Theory. My name is Josh Forti, and oh boy, we have a super exciting interview today guys. I’m very excited about this one. You guys know that one of the things that have been big for me over the past eight months, or so, has been building a business that allows me to remove myself from the process. I mean, I had my whole success breakdown per se of working myself for, you know, 18 hours a day for four years. Kind of kills you. And so, when I started the company that I have now with the agency stuff, we… the whole goal was to design it to remove yourself from the process. And then after, you know, my brother passed away, and I kind of realigned values, I was like, “Alright, there’s gotta be a way to create balance.” Work-life balance in whatever format that is.

Josh: 00:02:01 And we just finished up an episode on that talking about how we find that, and how that looks differently for each person, but this next person that I’m about to bring on here, is… was introduced to me by someone who actually was also on the podcast, and we got… turned into chit chat back and forth. He is a master at this. He is a master at building businesses, not jobs, and building businesses in a way that allows entrepreneurs to remove themselves from the process, and really have success in this. And, he is the author of multiple books. He has a new one coming out called “The Freedom Formula” coming up this September. We’re going to talk more about that. I’m very excited about it. But collectively, he… his advisory board, and the team that he has built around him has built and scaled over $60 billion worth of businesses. And, I just want to give him a big huge warm welcome and a thank you for taking the time to come on the podcast. David Finkel, thank you so much, man. I appreciate you being here.

David: 00:02:53 Yeah, Josh. I’m really excited to join… join you here for this interview and thank you for having me on.

Josh: 00:02:58 Absolutely. Okay. So how, how I don’t even know you. I mean like, we just really just now… how have you been man? How’s life?

David: 00:03:06 Life is going really good. So, you know, for me probably the most important things in my life are my kids. And, so I’ve got two 10-year-old twin boys, and my youngest son is six, about to turn seven. And, we just spent two weeks camping in Minnesota. We go out there every summer. And it’s been a great summer. I spent about the last maybe six weeks of it with my family and just had a great time. Some of the moments weren’t so perfect. Having any of your listeners that are starting with young kids, man, it can be tough. Sometimes they can challenge you, but that’s probably the thing I’m most grateful for.

Josh: 00:03:35 That’s amazing. And it’s funny because I’m like, I talked to a lot of different entrepreneurs and you know, just in this space or whatnot, but recently I’ve actually been a little bit more focused on learning about that. I am not married, I don’t have a family, but I will say I grew up, got a girl for, you know, I’m teaching. Yeah. I have a girlfriend. I just don’t, we’re not, we’re not married and no kids yet. But I grew up in a family of eight kids. And so watching how my parents interacted with us, I was homeschooled. I grew up on a farm. My Dad did work a lot but out of need, not middle-class family – paycheck to paycheck – you know, never knew hunger, but, watching how much they invested into us, I’m seeing more and more like how much that like played a part of my life. Right. And like really the focus being there. And so it’s always really cool to me to see entrepreneurs that are like kids focused and family-focused with that. And so where are you out of right now? Like where do you live?

David: 00:04:31 I live in Jackson Hole, Wyoming.

Josh: 00:04:33 Okay. In Jackson, Wyoming. Okay. So how do you, and I’m Kinda just out of the blue here, how do you manage that though? Like how many kids do you have? Three kids. So three kids. How do you manage $60 billion worth of scaling and building businesses over however the last 24 years too. You know, having three kids and still giving them the time that they need.

David: 00:04:55 Yeah. Well I appreciate that. It’s first of all the 60 billion of companies. I had a hand in a part of those ones. A lot of that was also independent with the other coaches and advisers staff that work with My, My business coaching company, Maui Mastermind. But I would tell you, it’s interesting for me that the central challenge has always been how, how can I do engaging, satisfying, um, profitable business and still have a great life without sacrificing health family on the other end. And I thought I learned it when I was in my late twenties into my early thirties. I, I built my first company, actually my second, my first company went out of business and you know, 11 months I was, I was done, went through my life savings 3,400 bucks. Um, but that was 22 years old. But when I came back at 26 and redid it again, I was about four years in and I’m sitting there in a new home. I had bought, I was in the hot tub the first time I’ve been in this hot tub after I bought the house six or seven months prior. The whole reason I bought the house, it’s cause this view in this hot tub and I was so depressed at that moment, Josh, I was burned out.

David: 00:06:00 I was traveling on the road two, three weeks out of each month. I was working 70, 80, 90 hour weeks, which are probably pretty familiar to a lot of your listeners. And I’m asking myself, is this all there is? I mean, I was on the scorecard of money was making more money than I’d ever would imagined. I would it in my early thirties more money than my dad who was a physician ever earned all this kind of stuff. But is this all there is I [inaudible] I want to have a family, I want these other things. I want to be healthy. All these things that I was totally shortchanging and I made this decision to build the business differently and my partner and I, about a year later after saying, well, we made the decision, but we didn’t do anything with it. We just, we just kept doing it the same way it was working.

David: 00:06:42 So I get on the plane and I would give the keynote, I’d come back and have meetings and deal with staff buyers and work with client complaints and client successes. And about a year later we, we just drew a line in the sand and said, you know what? We’re going to build this company so that it doesn’t need us. And over the course of three years before I sold my half of the business, that’s what we did [inaudible] meeting we had in Estes Park Colorado. And so that was probably my first wave of learning how to build a company independent. And, and after we started doing that, what I realized was the biggest challenge with me, I’m a control freak. I don’t know about you Josh, but man, feeling helpless and not being able to change it. And so by me micromanaging everything, it became, I was the biggest bottleneck and stumbling point for the companies I was building.

Josh: 00:07:28 It sounds like, I mean you’re obviously much further along in your journey than I am, but I’ll tell you the whole work, 80 90 hours a week traveled two or three weeks out of a month. Like that sounds very, very similar to where I was literally not too long ago, 20 months ago now is when I just kind of crashed. Right. And I was doing this same thing, making more money than I’d ever had, like more money than my parents. I was crazy. I’m curious though, I want to back up because you said something in there where you’re, you sit, you sit in the hot tub and you’re like, is this right? Did you struggle with like everyone else telling you how that was supposed to be? Cause like for me, I live on social media. Okay. So like my money has been made in the spotlight because I’ve grown 5 million followers on social media for four people write for clients.

Josh: 00:08:16 Hell. And I mean I had 100,000 followers at the time. Like every, you know, the spotlight was there. And so I had everybody telling me how to live my life and I listened to them. I didn’t know any better. Right? I’m 24 years old at the time or almost 24 years old at the time, you know, making 50 60 $70,000 a month balling out, right as a 23 year old with no direction. So for me, like when I sat there and asked myself that question, I was like, is this all there is? Everybody’s telling me like this shit, like bring me happiness. Like everyone was doing this. And I didn’t want to change because I felt like if I change, then people would think I had failed or that I couldn’t handle the stress. So like above and just asking yourself that question, like what were some of the factors that played into that?

David: 00:08:58 Yeah, that’s a great question. And a statement. I say to myself repeatedly, cause I still struggle at I’m, I’m 49 I still struggle with the same challenge, which is how can I live my life according to my values, not my vanity. Hmm. And I get stuck with that too. I mean, how do people are gonna Think? I, I write books, I, I, I have people who come to different events, you know, thousands of people come to events and see me at workshops and yeah. And so there’s sometimes feels like this task, that pressure on much better today about it than I was prior, but I can remember in my late twenties and I’m thinking I have to have a certain appearance with that part. You know, I have to have a certain lifestyle and the rest of it and I what I found for me, um, that has made a real difference.

David: 00:09:35 Um, or I’ll, I’ll share two quick things that are so easy. Number one, control your zip code. Um, I’ve lived in some pretty ritzy neighborhoods and when I live in those ritzy neighborhoods, I actually find a lot more implicit pressure to keep them with vanity versus values. And that’s one. Um, my wife and I, we live in a gorgeous place, Jackson Hole, certainly there’s a lot of affluence here, but we purposely chose a neighborhood to raise our kids. Now it’s a working class neighborhood. It’s a simple 2000 square foot house and a, it fits really well. It teaches the values without us having to teach them portion of it. So the zip code problem is a big one. And I’ve gotten house, I built a custom home for myself and a beautiful place in Charlottesville, Virginia, you know, gorgeous multi-million dollar homes. And what I realized was that that wasn’t the neighborhood for me.

David: 00:10:18 The second thing that was really there was I think for me, which was what was driving that behavior [inaudible] what this sense of fear of not being enough. And what I’ve come to realize is everyone, everyone has somewhere in their heart a small little hole. Some of us have it bigger than others that say I’m not enough. And just accepting that part of it has made it a lot easier to relax. People are going to judge me, people are going to misunderstand me, and that’s okay. Even if I try to control it, they’re still gonna do it and I’m gonna live my life on my terms. So.

Josh: 00:10:48 Hmm. What, so like for you, I, I’ve never heard the controlling the zip code before. I really, really liked that because that does play such a huge role. I mean, it just shift from different coasts or whatever. For you, how do you decide what is enough for you?

David: 00:11:03 Yeah. You know, what matters most, uh, I can give a couple of questions that I’ve asked myself over the years that have been useful, but what matters most in there? Getting clean on that. So for me it’s, it’s family. It’s health. I, I met and I’ve had a lot of great conversations with people who we’re 10 20, 30, 40 years, my senior, and these were people Joshua built, you know, $100 million companies, billion-dollar companies. And what I see for a lot of them was they didn’t take care of themselves along the way. They’re their kids. You know, some of them are starting with a second family. Um, and, and I understand it. I mean, you know, my wife and I, we’ve been married together now this will be our, we’re a bit coming up on our, our 16th anniversary and, uh, actually our 17 anniversary, excuse me, and we’ve been graduations, thank you, 21 years. But between the two of us, our parents have been married and divorced like nine times.

David: 00:11:57 So it was a real eye opener from that part of it. And, and so when I look at that, I, I think the big lesson for me was this idea of number one, if I’m going to compare myself to other people and I can’t help it all human beings, we all compare.

Josh: 00:12:09 everybody for sure.

David: 00:12:10 I’m going to compare myself to the whole picture. And that’s important. I’m not going to just put a spotlight. You, you mentioned about social media. I mean, of course that’s a, I can see the glamour version, but I want to compare myself to the fact that yeah, this, this, this person might’ve done x or y, but do they have a great relationship with their kids, for their kids light up when they come in the room? Does their spouse or significant other really care about them? Do they have a nurture relationship but they healthy?

David: 00:12:33 So for me, if I can’t have those things, then the money by itself is not going to be enough. The money will never fill me. Um, those other things matter. So I think that’s been pretty important. And I would ask the question, you know, imagine you got the news, um, you’ve got one year left to live, what do you do with that one year? Who are you going to talk with? What are you gonna do? Imagine they screwed up your result and it’s now it’s only 90 days. You have to live. What would you do? Hmm. And it was one day. And I kind of bring that down there and I’m asking myself, why am I not doing those things now? Yeah, what really matters most becomes pretty darn clear when time is fleeting. And I know it’s a cliche, but we don’t know when our last day is. And so I want to live that way.

Josh: 00:13:12 And that’s, and I think that’s super important. Um, my brother actually, so I have an older brother, seven, there’s eight kids in the family, so I have seven siblings. I’m the second oldest. Um, but my older brother, his name was Kyle, he tragically just passed away in March, uh, in a helicopter crash. And so it was like a freak accidents. You know, I’m, I’m 25. Right? And this happened a month after my 25th birthday. And so, um, that messed me up. You know what I mean? I mean, my whole family, I mean I have six younger siblings, four sisters, two brothers. Um, you know, those, my parents, you know, Oh hold this child. Like you have no idea how long you’re going to live for. And like this was someone who my, my brother was in politics pretty heavily. Um, it like journalism side of things.

Josh: 00:13:58 He ran a political consulting kind of firm or whatever. But like, I mean, he’s traveled all over right. And did it, he brought his family with him. He had a son, a baby on the way, like all this stuff. And you look at that and you’re like, oh my gosh. Like, like that. He was in the safest helicopter, the presidential of, you know, the president, vice president of Kenya, his personal helicopter, personal pilot, the whole nine yards, never in history has, has a helicopter of this model crash before ever. And that happens, right? So like, life can go so fast. And it’s interesting how much, I mean even for me at 25 and I go, I have a long time to live, hopefully if I live a fulfilled life, but like it’s amazing how much of my life changed and how my values shifted at this age when something like that happened. And I think that that’s excellent perspective with, you know, what you’re bringing, what you’re talking about there.

David: 00:14:44 I’m glad about that. I, and I screwed it up myself. I mean I sold my company when I was 35 years old who I sold half of it and then, and thought I was done and I proceeded to screw up how I invested the money and how did I do it? I, I, I let my vanity rule and, and I’ve got to keep that in check. A little bit of humility is good for all of us, especially when we start having those early successes and, and forget how hard it was to make those things work

Josh: 00:15:10 for real. How do you, so one of the things that you mentioned though was like you talked to older people, people that were, you know, 30 40 years ahead of you. Yeah. How do you determine who to listen to in that scenario? Because here’s my struggle. I believe that there is wisdom in age. I mean I look at me at 20 versus me at 25 and I’m like, oh my gosh, like two different people, you know, they over five years. But I also look at a lot of the world and I’ve, you know, I’ve listened to, you know, other people’s parents about things, whatever, particularly about money and about, you know, some advice on certain things. And I listened to that and I’m like, that advice is terrible. Like you don’t know how to make money, you don’t know business or you don’t know like this, like the money, the, the advice that I’m getting in a lot of areas from, you know, people that are maybe in their forties or their 50s is just terrible. But I know that because I have studied and researched money a little bit. Right. But like for life advice, for business advice when someone’s 30 or 40 years ahead of you and it’s not the Abi, I mean like you’re not sitting down with like a Warren Buffet, right? Like someone that you don’t know, but you have the ability to really seek wisdom from. How do you determine what is good advice and that you should listen to or what advice is maybe not the greatest advice for you specifically?

David: 00:16:27 Great, great question. Three quick answers. One is we don’t know what’s valuable in isolation. We only see the diamond in the rough when we put them all side by side and then it becomes obvious what it is. So I can’t just hear from one person, two people, I’ve got to look at it from 10 2030 40 people and I put them side by side too. So I, I asked the test of is this person in this area what I want to have? And then I asked a secondary question of has this person lived a life that I would want to have that same life? Yeah. Not so much from what is seen from the glamorous part, but is this person healthy? Is this person have rich relationships, is this person actually have a sense of of integrity? Can this person look themselves in the mirror?

David: 00:17:06 If I were that person, so if I asked those questions, they’ve done what I want to do in an area and the the processional parts of them match up, then I’m going to take with great seriousness what they say. Hmm. Um, and the third and final one, the biggest lesson is am I paying attention the results in my own life. A piece of advice I got years ago was this idea of we call it liked best and next time stopping and asking a regular basis what’s working well, what am I liking best about how I’m doing in an area of my company, an area of my business and area of my investing and area, my health, air in my relationships. What’s working well? I want to do more of that. And they asked the second question next time, what specifically, what I want to do differently next time based on what I’m learning so far and I don’t need to have next times.

David: 00:17:49 And this is a challenge. Look, you’re clearly someone who is a a success motivated person as are probably most of your listeners. And what’s going to happen is they’re going to come up with one or two like bass and 7,426 next times. It’s ridiculous. I see all the time I’ve fallen prey to it myself. The older I’ve gotten, what I realized is one next time that I actually do and do well means more than 7,429 different ones that I never, never actually implement. And so if I do the frequency of feedback where I’m not just doing this once a year on new year’s or my birthday or once a decade on the birthday, that turns zero, but I’m doing this on a, on a weekly basis in my business on a quarterly basis and all areas of my life, I’m going to make some pretty extraordinary jumps in that part.

David: 00:18:37 And now I can see what the experiment of using these ideas from other people that I’ve seen in comparison with each other. I can see what the effect is. And if it’s working, I do more of it. It’s not working out. Let it go.

Josh: 00:18:49 That’s awesome. Hoo. That’s some really good advice. Who is the most interesting person that you’ve got to meet and ask? Like advice from? Yeah, so, uh, you know, I put together over the years, about about 12 or 13 years ago, my own personal mastermind group, a group of people that we’ve had some change in an end membership. But you know, we get together two or three times a year in person. We get together every two weeks by phone. And these have been people who have become like my own personal board of directors. And there’s one of the, one of the mastermind people on, on my group.

David: 00:19:19 He’s just one of the most interesting people. He has a very different take on life. He comes from a very different background. I’m from a different country, from a different, um, upbringing and, and, and whenever he gives me input, I love that he asked me questions that challenges my root assumptions. And some of the other mastermind partners, they’re just good people who’ve done some pretty extraordinary things. But this one gentleman just consistently sees the world through a different Lens. And, uh, anytime I’m around him, I love that he challenges my root assumptions cause I’m, I’m pretty stubborn and I think I know a lot more than I do. And he helps me realize that I’m actually a quite a bit more, um, in the weeds than I realized that are in the wrong place. And he asked these naive questions that just changed the frame of everything. You know what I’m talking about? I thought,

Josh: 00:20:06 yeah, yeah. But do you have an example or something, something that like for the listeners that might never have asked those questions, like what you’re referring to, do you have an example? Like something?

David: 00:20:15 Sure, I’ll give an example for somebody else. So someone comes to me and, and, and it’s like, uh, I’ll go like next week. Um, somebody it comes to me and says, you know, David, I’m really struggling to make this key higher in our company. How do I do that? Like I’ll give an example of a client. We coach, um, you know, he and his company, they’re about a $12 million a year business. They do a wholesale for a particular type of industry, aerospace parts. Really Nice Guy. They have an issue where they, they need salespeople and that’s their biggest stumbling factor. And uh, Aye.

David: 00:20:47 I, I teased him a little bit. I said, Nate, you know, you’re out here hiring, but let me ask you what about doing x, Y, and z? And so here’s some x, Y and Z is that he had never even thought about. He’s thinking about hiring. As I put the ad out there or work with a recruiter, I fill my opening. Well, like your, you’re always hiring. Why aren’t you, you’re, you know, you’re an ex athlete. Why aren’t you building a farm system? You know, how do college sports succeed? They don’t build a great team. They build a great program, which means they have to have recruiters out there everywhere. I said, the next time you’re at, you know for him, the salespeople he finds best are people who are extraordinarily engaging. He sees him in restaurants or other places. I’m like, you tell me, look back over the last six months, have you run into five or 10 people at restaurants?

David: 00:21:26 When you’re out there with your wife at a restaurant or at a retail store, which have been some of your most successful pyres for people who come from that background. When’s the last time you started looking for these people while you’re doing your day to day shopping and eating and in life? He’s like, I had thought about that way. You know what? That’s an example. That’s a kind of more of a mundane one with that. So this mastermind partner asked me one time a challenge question. I’ll give an example. You said you’re not enjoying what you’re doing. This is back when I had a business that it wasn’t as much fun with a partner that just was the wrong fit. And his comment was, he asked me, he said, David, what hole are you trying to fill with your partner? Yeah. When I realized was I was just scared.

David: 00:22:08 My first real success, I had a business partner and I learned this lesson. Oh, if I have a business partner, I can build a multi-million dollar business very quickly. And I tried in my new company, four different partnerships, all of which were the wrong fit until he asked me that question. I’m like, you know what, I don’t need that partner. I don’t know why I was trying to fill that part of me that was scared with the partner. I just hired the key people that I needed. And you know, we’ve been growing 20 plus percent per year for the last eight or nine years. Wow. But it was his perspective to see it fresh and different by asking me a great question, a naive question that changed everything.

Josh: 00:22:43 It’s a super interesting and this, this, that out of the box thinking. How much do you think travel plays into like traveling and seeing like different parts of the world? Uh, or even different parts of the country. How much does that play into your, like your perspective of like figuring out and being able to figure out problems?

David: 00:23:01 Yeah. Yeah. Travel is a really interesting question. I, I don’t think you need to travel the world to become someone who has a really, uh, a, a sharp, insightful, novel way of seeing the world. I think you need to pay attention to the world that you’re in with fresh eyes. Um, I had a conversation with a gentleman who’s a New York Times bestselling authors, names Andy Andrews. Really just a nice man. And uh, what he does is he sees the world through really different eyes. He, he was doing it through the form of a joke. He shared with me a joke about, you know, hey, um, we all say that don’t run with sticks cause you’ll poke your eyes out and he says, no one can poke their eyes out with a stick.

David: 00:23:35 No, the stick you can poke your eye in but not out, you know, to poke your eye out. You have to go through your nose with the stick and go out with it. And I was laughing, but he just, he’s a comedian who’s written these books and he’s just, he sees world fresh. It wasn’t because he traveled overseas to Europe, to Asia, to South America, to Africa. It wasn’t any of that. It was the fact that he looked fresh at the world and the people have this curious sense of eyes. Um, you can find this travel in your own community. I can go through Jackson here and I can go look at businesses that do things incredibly well and I can find businesses that do things incredibly stupid way. I mean if I just look at them and look at it from a novel sense, you know, what, what can I take from this and that, that question and no gun.

David: 00:24:16 Going back to this idea, like challenging ideas, one of the central challenges that I want to think differently about was I used to think about, I built a company by working hard and you know, everyone would say work hard, work hard, work hard. It’s become this, this trike cultural mean as if the way you become, they have the weight champion, the world is your like, you know, Rocky Balboa, you get in there, you just take punishment for five or 10 years at the end of it you’re declared the winner. And that that’s just such a, a crazy thing. The way people succeed in business is not by taking the punishment, it’s by focusing ruthlessly. And I don’t mean ruthlessly from a values perspective. I mean like being ruthless with themself with I’m going to focus today on what do I do that actually creates value. When I started the freedom forum, that was with that central premise, everyone knows that they should work smarter, but so few people actually know what that actually means.

David: 00:25:09 So how do you operationalize what it means to work smarter individually and as a company, which is why in the book I focused on that, but it’s a way of thinking differently. Most people live in a time and effort world. Hmm. But yet if I can step into the value economy, I don’t get paid for hours, effort and attitude. I get paid for results, right. I need some hours. Yes I need some effort, but it’s a different type of our different type of efforts. Ah, I need blocks at my best time, focused on my very best, most high value activities and I do that in two hours. I can create the value that someone else might take two years in my business.

Josh: 00:25:46 That’s such a good way to look at it. And I think that I like how you put that cause a lot of people have said, oh you know, just work harder or work smarter, not harder. But like you said, they don’t know what that looks like. I think that’s a good analogy. I guess my question for you would be, and this is maybe looking at it before we dive into actually how that’s done. There is a question that I get asked a lot and I am someone that also looks at like ethical dilemmas and um, you know, more of a, like a philosopher type person. I wouldn’t call myself a philosopher, but you know what I mean. Like I like that stuff. So like looking at it from a perspective of the worker. Okay. I am about as capitalist as they come. All right. Like I wear a shirt that says capitalist pig on it. All right. So like there’s no, no saying that, you know, I’m anti-capitalism, I love capitalism that said, I, I understand the argument. Like I came from a working class family. I worked at a, a grainery making $8 an hour at 18 years old and I would work 50 hours

Josh: 00:26:44 a week doing a job that was, you know, literally against OSHA regulations. Like I should have been paid at least 20 or $30 an hour, right? At least for that, that I was making $8 an hour for. And so one could look at someone like me and be like, ah, you have a factory job that kinda sucks. Right? And look at the owner of the company and be like, you’re working smart, right? You’re working smarter. You’re not in there doing the day to day operations. Right. Yet I’m getting screwed over. Or even if I’m not necessarily getting screwed over the amount of work that I’m doing, four, eight 20 $30 an hour collective with everybody else obviously is making the owner of that company significantly more money. Right? Like, and they’ve been smart about that, but there’s the argument that’s like, do you really like making $30 million a year or $50 million a year or whatever that company does.

Josh: 00:27:34 Does the CEO or the owner of that, that’s just work smarter, do they really deserve to keep all that information for themselves and not give it back to the employees, not give back to the people that are actually doing the work. Like where’s the balance of that when it comes to working smart and just hiring a bunch of other people to do their tasks rather than collectively bringing it up. I think you understand where I’m going with that.

David: 00:27:57 I do. And I want to challenge your thinking here to think of you think differently, which is there’s a supposition that you have in your thinking there, which is that, uh, the way someone works smarter is by getting other people to do the work, whether it’s got work in the warehouse, working sweaty hard hours like you had or the Amazon warehouse employees that you hear about or something. And, and, or you’re working the smart, like the, the owner of the company who’s just kind of sitting on a beach enjoying life. And it, I would challenge that thinking. Um, I used to think, oh, I’ll build a company and I’ll make sure I’m a good person by taking a percentage of what I earn and give to charity. And a book challenged my thinking and the book basically said, look, the best way that you can do good in the world is by building an extraordinary company. And I think that’s true. The, the place that I will have the biggest impact and contributing to the welfare of other people. And I mean this sincerely outside of my family and raising my kids and being a good husband with my wife for me is going to be the company that I do. It’s going to impact my team members, is going to impact their families.

David: 00:29:00 Um, it’s going to impact all my clients. When I look at things like you, you have some business realities. That business has to be sustainable [inaudible] and for the business to be sustainable, it has to be profitable. Otherwise you have no sustaining with that part. But I look at this and I say, okay, how can my business do good in the world? Not through charitable efforts. All of that’s wonderful too. But the core service or product that I create, if I’m not doing something good in the world, I’m in the wrong business with that part. Team members, if I, if I look at this value economy, how can I create a company that people love working? So for example, one of the chapters in the book, we talk in there about this idea of engaging your team, look at nonprofits. So in the course of 2017, which is the last year, we have statistics for it, over 900 million people donated time to charity.

David: 00:29:46 They performed over $1 trillion of service without being paid. How would you treat your best people if they were volunteers, if they weren’t employees? Now paid volunteers because your best people, they are volunteers. They could easily go across the street, make more money. Um, and at the only thing keeping them there at your place of work is inertia or compensation that the first thing that comes to jar that relationship, you’ll lose them. So what can I do? You know, people listening, his pockets are probably smaller business owners. Great. I can offer flexibility like my staff, um, uh, share with it. You know, Kim, who just runs our marketing, she just got back from her trip. She took her family to the coastline. She has a degree of flexibility, of location and degree of flexibility on schedule in a way that no one else could offer her.

David: 00:30:37 I can’t compete on certain benefits if she wants to go to work for a fortune 50 company. You know, they’re gonna, they’re gonna, they’re gonna Outbid me on price. They’re going to outbid me on. Um, probably some of the training programs, but I can take and give her esteem. I can, uh, I can give her affirmation by letting her have an impact. I can give her flexibility. I can give her a place where she is valued, where she can create value by her following the same things. Like for example, do I want her tied to email every day doing nothing more than just responding reflexively to email? No. I want to make sure that she’s blocked off five, 10, 15 hours of our best time each week, just like I do to create value for the company. And if I can project that through the company and build a company that has more depth than any one person, what I’m doing is I’m creating a workplace where people really want to be because they can make a difference and make a living with that part.

David: 00:31:30 I don’t want my team members working 70, 80 hours a week. That would kill me. First of all, it feel in inconsistent with what our values are. I don’t think that that’s good business. I see many companies or they’ll have people working 80 a hundred hour work weeks. Well, okay, there are one heart attack or one mental breakdown from losing that person and having all the wheels fall off right off the bus. So how do I create a workplace where I reward compensation at tension, affirmation, opportunity, responsibility for creating value, and do that in assessing in a sane, humane way of doing it. I don’t think I have to make the choice between extraordinary value creation and taking advantage of the people that work with me. I don’t, I think that’s a false dilemma.

Josh: 00:32:17 Hmm. I like that a lot. That’s a really interesting way to look at it. And I think that especially when you’re talking about like even like an email assistant, right? Someone whose primary goal is to do customer service related work, even allowing them to dedicate time of their best time to add value to the company, maybe improve their systems. Do you know, projects that they think could make their life and their job. I think that’s a very, very interesting, uh, way to look at things. So I appreciate that. I want to switch now cause I have some questions about, and I know the listeners as well, I want to switch to kind of your, how you got into learning about how to build a business, not just a job, right? And being able to remove yourself from the process. I would venture to say based on our conversation, based on the books that you’ve written in the little that I know about you, that you could probably step away from your company for a few weeks and everything would be just fine. Right? Most people, an overwhelming majority of people, especially in this space of their business that we, we target a lot of people that are start up to under a hundred thousand dollars a year. I mean I’m sorry, $100,000 a month or less. Like kind of in that frame.

Josh: 00:33:22 Most of them could not walk away from their business for even a week without it falling apart. So take us back to when that verse became for you. It sounds like you are, you know, into your company, you drew a line in the sand with your business partner over the next three years. But like what happened and how did you learn that?

David: 00:33:39 Oh, I’ll share three things that have worked really well with that. So one of them we call building strategic depth. So the first of all is most of the knowhow and knowledge in the company is informally kept in the head of the business owner or in a couple of key employees. If they have any systems that are done on scraps of paper post-its or they’re kept on individual separate computers. So we call it the your UBS, the ultimate business system, right? Business partner I way back when, um, you still love acronyms. So we came up with [inaudible] business system, but the acronym was not very appropriate. So we added the word ultimate in front of it. [inaudible] and so of all your systems, and if someone wants more on this, they can certainly go to chapter four, the freedom formula. But here’s what it is. In a nutshell, how do I centralize in one cloud-based place where I have all the systems that aren’t captured in a, in a software platform? Um, so if I’m using a project management tool, I’m not going to put that in, in, in my ups, but the, the videos for how a new person, uh, it takes on a new client. Um, the checklist for how we work with a new vendor, the standardized template for a contract we use with all new suppliers, all that is going to be centralized.

David: 00:34:45 I’m going to think to myself, what would be the five to seven main categories, you know, sales, marketing, operations, finance team, um, leadership and inside of there, I’m going to pick one area to start with. Let’s say I choose HR a team. Great. My sub areas are gonna include hiring, recruiting a second sub area in there that might find that this is going be section two 2.0 of my UBS. So 2.1 hiring 2.2 onboarding, 2.3 training, 2.4 benefits in HR Admin, 2.5 exiting people. And so I just load it with what I currently have for systems and then I just ask an easy question. What one system don’t we have that costs us the most or hurts us the most or could hurt us the most for not having that? I could start on this quarter. I build one system this quarter or one piece of the system this quarter and initially Josh is just going to be the owner doing this.

David: 00:35:37 They might only have two or three part time people around them later on when you start having a few full time people with you ask them to do the same thing in their area of the company. The key is is this is not building a manual. This is not creating a policies and procedures manual. It’s out of date. The moment it is. This is about creating a, a company where it’s a discipline in your company to build systems, use systems, refine systems and store systems in a place where other people can find them, which means naming them sanely so that the next person who searches the folder finds it instantly. If they don’t find it within 60 seconds, they’re going to assume it doesn’t exist. They’re going to start a new version of it. Now you have two versions and neither one’s got the best of it.

David: 00:36:16 So your UBS becomes less valuable. If it’s less valuable, they use it less if they use it less, if it comes even more, less valuable and you have a, a spiraling situation. So I need to make it progressively more valuable. That’s one too. Um, how do I focus on, I’ll give you a simple tech and we call it the sweet spot analysis. So this is in chapter three. Um, and if they want to download a version of this, I’ll go ahead and actually I do want to get to that, but really quick for your systems, what software do you use to keep everything organized? Yeah, great question. So, I mean today’s world, any of the cloud based tools that work well. So if there a Microsoft person, they can use drive, uh, you know, for Microsoft, you know, the, the office three 65 has a built in component for that.

David: 00:36:57 You know, Google drive works well. Dropbox, we use ignite, it’s a paid version. It has a little bit more, um, security features and, and granular control of things. I’ve liked it. We’ve got clients who will use all of them. So, you know, Dropbox, Google, Microsoft are probably the big ones that most of our clients use.

Josh: 00:37:16 We use Google drive and then we also, you know, communicate with slack. So where on.

David: 00:37:21 the one key with it is, is if they do everything cloud browser based, what happens is, is that they’re not going to save everything that they’re doing. So specifically, if I set up, for example, um, a folder on my computer, that’s all my Dropbox stuff, I don’t want to do all my files through a browser to get into the UBS because what’ll happen is invariably I’ll have stuff saved locally that doesn’t get in there.

David: 00:37:45 But if I treat it just like a folder on my drive,

Josh: 00:37:47 Yep.

David: 00:37:48 Everything will get in there. And that’s pretty important. I’ve just seen that go rye.

Josh: 00:37:51 Yeah, we do that pretty heavily actually. Like I’m pretty anal about making sure, cause it’s something that we’ve had to grow in the last eight months. But like we don’t use Microsoft word, we don’t use anything like excel, like nothing on a computer. It all has to be in the cloud because it’s one person works on it. It has to be updated. So everything on drive that we use, it’s all through drive excel, it’s Google sheets, Microsoft word, it’s Google docs. Um, so that it is all cloud based.

David: 00:38:18 Great. As long as everyone’s doing that, you’re good. The moment you hire someone in your case who’s probably 40 or above and I’m 49, you’re going to find that they’re going to put it on their local computer and Upload and they won’t upload everything. But if everyone’s doing it, you’re totally good there.

Josh: 00:38:30 Perfect. Um, I want to continue down this road, but I do want to stop for those people that are listening right now. Tell us about your book a little bit. We’ll get to this more at the end, but where can people go find out more about the book that’s coming out? Get some, you know, some sneak peeks of it, stuff like that.

David: 00:38:45 Sure. So the title of the books, The Freedom Formula: How to Succeed in Business Without Sacrificing your Family Health or Life. And essentially what the books done is it’s, it’s done to give you a way to operationalize how to work smarter. The first half tells you how to do it individually. The second half tells you how to do it with the team. It’s written for any entrepreneur or business owner or executive who wants to say, how do we actually do this mechanics step by step. Not the what to do, but the how to do the what to do in terms of working smarter. You can get it on Amazon, Barnes and noble, any local book, seller, tattered book. If you’re in Denver, the tattered book, you know, Tad Recovery Bookstore, whatever you want with that. Do you want to find more though? You can just go to freedom, freedom and on that site you’ll find information about the book. You can even download two free chapters to see if it’s for you. Um, and I think, I think what they’re going to find is that they, they read even one chapter of that they’re going to, if it’s, if it resonates, they’re going to get the book 100%. And it guys, you’ve sold me man, I’m, I’m buying the book. I mean anything when it comes to systems and organizing my life, God knows I need it.

Josh: 00:39:50 Um, and uh, I wanted to have that freedom as well. So, um, guys, we’re gonna a link that down into the description, both on youtube, on iTunes and things of that nature. Like anywhere down you’ll be able to find the link to the book link to this sneak peeks as well. Check that out. Um, show some support there cause it sounds like a super, super good book. Okay. Let’s dive back into the figuring this thing out though. So systems, we talked about that like point number one is documenting everything. If it’s in your head or on scrap paper, it’s not a real system.

David: 00:40:18 Yeah, and I would, I would go back for the, this the first starting point is to make the decision that I’m going to build an owner, independent company. I’m not going to get there as a light switch. I just flipped a switch one day. It’s going to be a progression. But having done this before myself, having coached thousands of companies through the same process, give yourself three years, five years, 10 years, any of your listeners can do the same thing themselves. And here’s the cool part. Even if I never build an owner, independent company, and even if I’m still needed, I can still build a company where I can take time off.

Josh: 00:40:47 a question and I’m glad you brought this up. Define what an owner, independent company really is because I think there’s a lot of misconception around that.

David: 00:40:58 Sure. So we define it this way. So, first of all, it’s not like owning a stock of Coca Cola and I’m not going to work at all. We defined it as if I’m working 10 hours or less per month or if I could leave my business for three months or longer and have it be more valuable when I get back healthier to have grown in my three month absence. You’ve got an odor independent company.

Josh: 00:41:20 So in that scenario, well what does the owner do if I’m working 10 hours a month or less or you know, can leave for three months, I come back, I’m an entrepreneur, right? If, and most people are that are, you know, are listening and wanting to do this, we’re going to get bored. Right? It’s not like I’ve never met anyone that can just, you know, I see all these people with like 30 40 $50 million excess and they go in like a year later they’re back into it cause they’re like, we’re so bored. Right. So when you get to that point, do you recommend still working like more in the company than you have to and continue to help it grow? Started something new, like what does someone that has achieved that do with their time?

David: 00:41:59 Great. So let me give you the model. So you have three levels of building a business level one, the startup, just getting going. Find those early customers. Level two, the owner, dependent company to company. That works, but it works because it’s relying on the owner level three on or independent company at level three you now get to make a choice. Do I want to sell? Do I want to continue to own it passively or do I want to continue to stay in the business? Just because I can leave the business, it doesn’t mean I should, right. So I’ve sold the company because I was no longer passionate about it. It worked well. The company I’m in right here today, I don’t want to sell it. I want it to be a generational business. Not necessarily that my sons are going to take over, but I want the business to create value in the world after I’m no longer working in it and I don’t see myself stopping.

David: 00:42:41 I’m 49. I don’t see myself stopping anywhere in the next 10 years. I, I’ve done that before. It’s boring, but I don’t want to start a new deal. I love what I’m doing. I want to continue it. I’m smart about it. I’m going to set a hard stop. I’m going to work 40 hours a week. That’s my heart stop. I’m like an astronaut. Those are my consumable of oxygen. That’s all I have to work with. I’m gonna take 10 weeks, a year of vacation. Um, that’s what I’ve decided for me, fits best. So once they’ve reached that point, they don’t have to quit the business. They just get to choose to intentionally how they want to be in the business.

Josh: 00:43:12 Hmm. That makes sense. What do you do? What 10 weeks of vacation? Where do you go?

David: 00:43:19 So I live in a gorgeous spot, so I stay in Jackson for a lot of it. And we went to Spain this past year. I’m less than a travel. My wife’s much more into that. We go camping a lot. Um, uh, simple stuff, national parks, other things. Are you into sports at all? I used to be. I used to play field hockey and the US national team, but I haven’t done sports for probably 20 years. I once I got a little bit older, it’s harder, so I’m very active, but it’s more hiking, camping types of activity, working out, but not as sport. I get hurt if I try to do it. My brain thinks I’m, I’m young, my body tells me I’m not.

Josh: 00:43:49 Do you, do you watch sports at all?

David: 00:43:52 No. I’m much more of a participant. I don’t want to watch other people do cool stuff. I want to do cool stuff myself.

Josh: 00:43:56 You want to do cool stuff? Yeah. I feel that. Is there ever a point in your life like in your business? I don’t know that you made a big somehow, right? Like, I mean like big, I have no idea how much your worth, I don’t know how much you make. None of my business, but is there ever a point where like, I don’t know, you have a $10 billion exit or something like that, right. Where you’re just like, screw it. I’m done. Like, I’m just, I’m super done and I’m never working again. Or are you always going to be working?

David: 00:44:22 Yeah. So, so for me, um, whether it’s 10 billion, 10 million, 10,000, you know, the net worth and is relative to how much your lifestyle cost. We call that your s factor, right? How much you’re spending to live. But the reality is I don’t want to not work. So for me, I just want to work on my terms. I want to enjoy and I want to have meaning and fulfillment. For me, working as a piece of that, um, it’s something that brings me a great deal of joy creation and, and the rest of that. So, you know, let’s say I had a $10 billion exit. Fantastic. Um, first of all, I’m going to continue to do something that I find meaningful and worthwhile, which is probably going to be a portion of that in business and a portion outside of that. Health, family relationships, the rest of it, I’m doing that now. I’ll just probably do it on a bigger scale.

Josh: 00:45:09 Hmm. So when it comes to making money and when it comes to uh, like you’re successful in business, you’ve got some businesses that you run, you’re making, I would imagine far, far more than your monthly expenses would be, right? Where are you putting that money? Are you a stock market type person? Are you a real estate type person or are you a just by businesses? Like what, where’s it going?

David: 00:45:33 Yeah, before I do that, I’m going to finish off the answer to the earlier question. You say, well what do I do? Early stages. So yeah, I made the decision. The secondly is I have to focus my company’s limited discretionary best talent and attention on the things that matter. So every quarter I’m going to create a one page plan of action. I’m going to have one, two or three focus areas. And this is basically where I’m going to put my discretionary time or later on when I have other staff member their best discretionary time. And I’ll lead one more tool here. I want people to be able to walk away and do something with this.

David: 00:46:03 Please, please. Oh, the sweet spot analysis. So ask yourself the question, what’s the one limiting factor for your company, the one ingredient capital l capital app more than anything else that currently constrained your growth of your company? And you might say it’s sales. Okay, if it’s sales, is it you need more leads coming in the front end or no, maybe you have enough leads. What you really need is is better sales capacity or better conversion. Is it better conversion caused by and in the more narrow way I can define that limiting factor. Now I do a sweet spot analysis. I I brainstorm 10 20 different ideas to push that limiting factor back and I put each of those ideas in an in series through two different filters, low hanging fruit and home runs. I ask of everyone on my idea. So if I, if for me I need more leads is my number one limiting factor.

David: 00:46:49 Great. What’s come up with all my ideas for creating more leads? Is this a low hanging fruit? Meaning is it easy to do? High likelihood of working. I ask of every item on my list. Is this low hanging as this low hanging? And if it is, I check the box for low-hanging and then in a second separate pass I ask is this a home run? If it’s a home run, it means if it works, will it have a big impact? Is this a home run, is this a home run? I go through the list and what I’m looking for is the one, two or three ideas that are both low hanging fruits and home runs and by definition that’s probably the bay, the best place for me to focus my initial discretionary best talent on this quarter. It’s already a high leverage cause it’s my number one limiting factor and number two, it’s an idea that’s low hanging fruit, easy to do, high likelihood of working [inaudible] home run. It’s a big impact. That’s my sweet spot and if someone wants to get a download the form for that, they can go to freedom as part of that toolkit, I hope they get the book, but even if they did and they can still get the toolkit for free and in there is the pdf for for how to, to do that with. As an example filled out for them to learn from. But if I do those things now, where do I invest the money? Um, early on.

Josh: 00:47:58 Oh hold on. I, I, you know, I do want to touch on that cause that’s, that’s amazing. Like that’s really, really good information that I think a lot of people need to hear. And that was Freedom Toolkit.

David: 00:48:06

Josh: 00:48:07 guys, go check that out cause it’s super good. So you’ve gone through, you’ve identified home runs and low hanging fruit. Where’s the sweet spot or what activities are going to be both of them that are going to move my business forward.

David: 00:48:22 Right.

Josh: 00:48:23 For the person that, cause I hear this a lot too. They’re making, they’re, they’re in the startup phase. They’re 10,000 bucks a month or less. Right? And they’ve got expenses. Maybe they’re bringing home, I don’t know, three grand a month. Right? Like they’re just kind of making ends meet and they’re everywhere. They’re scatterbrain, they haven’t really clearly defined yet what they’re doing and they’re still trying to figure it out. And maybe this isn’t who you work with, but I feel like you’re kind of smart, so you’ll know. Um, so like I’m at this point and it’s like, okay, I know I want to do this, right? Like I know that this is kind of the direction that I’m going, but I’m not really making money in that yet. I know there’s a market there, I just haven’t figured it out yet. But I’ve got these other things that are kind of keeping the business alive. And if I just go like 100% into it, it’s not that number one, I don’t have the money. But let’s even pretend I did have the money. I’ve got all these other responsibilities. I can’t just like cut off. Right? I can’t just make this switch. What’s your advice to them?

David: 00:49:20 So he called this dilemma and it’s funny, a lot of our clients started us initially had the same dilemma. Now they tend to be people who have businesses that are half a million dollars to $20 million. This is the sweet spot of who we work with. But, but we call this the dilemma between cash flow and capacity. And so cashflow is the today’s reality. I need to have money coming in today. Capacity is things that would be for the future. And if you think about that as a, as a scale and in the middle is the fulcrum and a balancing it off. The more financial strength I have, the more I can move the fulcrum to be more skewed to the future. The more I’m on the financial edge, the more I have to skew for today’s needs. So if I’m doing an action plan and I’m a company, it’s a startup, I might have to have the first one, two, three quarters that I do my action plan, everything be about today, things that in the next 90 to 180 days pay off.

David: 00:50:09 But somewhere I’m going to build enough of a cushion to be able to have one of my three focus areas this quarter be something that might have a pay off six, 12 months down the road. I can’t afford to have everything pay off three years from today cause I’ll be out of business. So if I think about it from that frame, the business is strength, allows me to give some to the future. But early on I might have to go 95% of my energy on today’s needs. And the key for that person is I can’t go after 20 things. I don’t have the resources to do that. I’ll give an example for our business coaching company. We used to have a line of business that did online training programs. We had a line of business that did public workshops for business leaders and entrepreneurs, and we had a line that was our business coaching.

David: 00:50:51 We were under 5 million a year in sales. We could not do all three of those things. World-Class. The best decision we ever made was to focus on one of those things. In this case, we chose business coaching as a service, as a service, and we stopped offering and selling those other things separately, which was really painful because we drive significant revenue there. Right? Um, but it’s what’s led to huge growth. I mean we’ve tripled over the last six years, seven years, company revenue and profit because we focused on fewer things that matter more. So you know, you have to get yourself to a place where you have a little bit of cushion focused on today then. But afterwards, some of what you have to do is say notice stuff because if you don’t say no to something, um, you’re going to find yourself scrambling and half doing too many things that come to pay off.

Josh: 00:51:38 Yeah. I mean it wasn’t, Warren Buffet said the most powerful word in the English language is no. Yeah, there you go. So it was a big one. Okay, appreciate that. Now wrapping it up, let’s move over to the investment of the money side of things. You’ve made a bunch of money now what?

David: 00:51:52 Yeah, the, the easiest thing for somebody like early on, I try, I, I used to do a lot of coaching and teaching and real estate. That was my first company and I, I, I did hundreds of single family house investments. Our clients bought and sold over a billion dollars of properties. So I, when I sold my company went a lot into real estate and I sold it at the very beginning of 2006 so in 2006 I bought a lot of real estate.

Josh: 00:52:15 Oh No.

David: 00:52:16 Would I really since then is I’ve gotten much more strategic. So for me, if I’m on the early end, here’s the simplest thing to do. Index Equity Index s and p 500 total stock market, but here’s the one piece. There is a place for you to get risk-free return premium over and above without taking on any more risk that they should absolutely max out first, which is tax advantage on their investing. If they’re not maxing out their Roth IRA, if they don’t have a a 401k or solo 401k for their company or at least a Sep Ira. Before I worry about what I’m going to do with my hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars of annual investments with my thousands of dollars. I just do a simple Roth especially cause most of your listeners are young. I do it for my kids. You know I’m going to invest in Max that out six grand a year. I’m going to stop doing that when they’re 20 when they turn 65 they’re going to have three or $4 million of tax free money on there just from what I did in the first 20 so if I’m in my twenties what I wished I would’ve done, I wish I would have maxed out all my retirement options and just in it with a simple pure equity index fund, low cost should be less than one half of 1% for my expense fee. If I did nothing more than doing that and rode that out for 30 years, 40 years, you’re going to have a fortune in there and you’re going to have a secure, really good freedom in that retirement time.

Josh: 00:53:35 Interesting. All right. I always like to ask that question from different people because the answer is so vary from, you know, different people are around themselves. I love [inaudible].

David: 00:53:45 I would also caution the best place for them to invest in themselves in their business before that. But in it, if we’re putting money into an investment, it’s less about what they’re investing in. It’s how they’re investing initially. Once they max out all the retirement stuff, then the other stuff matters more.

Josh: 00:53:59 What is your personal favorite place? Not from a strategic standpoint, like not, not coaching other people on how to do it, but just for you personally, where’s your, your personal favorite place to store large sums of cash in investments?

David: 00:54:11 Is it business like they like asset back debt. Um, so it might, you know, yeah, I don’t need growth from my investments from the person. I want more women called Pri passive residual income at this stage. So, um, you know, I certainly I do the equity indexing myself. I do commercial real estate and those are growth plays. My company is my biggest growth play by far. Yeah. But I liked the cashflow. It comes off of really good debt that’s backed by real estate. I like that conservatively underwritten and again, I wouldn’t just go do that. I would actually wait till I had some expertise in it. Yeah, I think I’m pretty good at, so that works well for me.

Josh: 00:54:45 Cool. Cool. All right, well I super appreciate this. I want to go to rapid fire questions because we end every interview with just a couple of rapid fire questions really quick. Um, but before we do that, once again, just tell everybody the listeners where they can find out more about a use last year book. Um, just in case they missed it beforehand.

David: 00:55:01 Yeah, they can go ahead and get a sneak peak. They can get the toolkit, they can learn more about us at

Josh: 00:55:09 guys and your book comes out when September 3rd so hopefully when this gets played it’ll be out and available and all the different bookstores. All right, so to be out and available by then guys, go check it out. September 3rd I have, it’s past September 3rd it’s available if not, go to freedom toolkit and get it as soon as it comes out. David, thank you so much for your time. I appreciate it. I want to move to rapid fire questions. Um, first question is not so much a rapid fire question, but I do want to ask it cause it’s a personal question that I have.

Josh: 00:55:36 I’m 25 years old. Okay. What would you tell someone like me, I grew up pretty conservatively. Kay. And I’m not saying I want to do this necessarily, but there’s the urge of every 25 year old that has a little bit of money. You could go do this. If the urge is yo I’ve got a hundred grand saved up, I can just go live it up. Right. I can travel for you know, one or two years and maybe, maybe I’m not, you know, maybe even been 2123 I’ve got a good network, I’ve done my business, I can pay my bills, whatever. I’m not quite to the point yet where I’m focused and driven enough to want to go and actually build a real company. Cause I meet a lot of people like this. This isn’t me as much. I’m pretty more conservative with my money. But like would you say, you know what, if you’re going to go blow 2030 $40,000 go do it while you’re young. Go travel the world, go see do it. Get it out of your system and then come down and sit down with everything and get started to work. Or are you of the mentality that says pay your dues. Just focus. You don’t pay off in the long run.

David: 00:56:36 I say don’t do either one. I say do it along the way. I mean why? Why would you want it to be a one time shot thing with that part? You know what you, you have a geo flexibility today that people could only dream of. Once upon a time you want to go, go live overseas for three months, go, go, go live overseas and work from overseas and do, do great stuff. With that part, I wouldn’t do one or the other and I would do them both and I wouldn’t just do them for one year. I do it for the next 70 years of your life. Hopefully you live that long.

Josh: 00:57:02 I love that answer. All right. A true rapid fire questions now. Favorite airline to fly

David: 00:57:09 Delta Delta.

Josh: 00:57:10 I Love Delta. It’s my favorite one ever. Um, most interesting or like famous person I should say that you’ve ever met?

David: 00:57:17 Oh Gosh. Um, most interesting famous person that I met. Yeah, I would, I would probably say there’s a guy by the name of Jason Jennings in New York Times best selling author. The guy’s just fascinating to talk with.

Josh: 00:57:27 Interesting. Okay.

David: 00:57:28 Or is this book you should read it. It’s a great book. What’s it called? Less is more. It’s one of my 10 favorite business books 30 years ago and it’s still a classic.

Josh: 00:57:37 Awesome. Huh. Well, I’ll have to check that one out as well. Um, secret like dream fantasy kind of thing that are maybe not secret, but like that you want to do at some point in your life, like a bucket list thing that you wanna do that you haven’t done yet.

David: 00:57:49 Yeah. Um, go off for a year with just my wife and I without kids when they’re grown and just go travel. Working with that part of it along the way, but just to go travel and live out of a motor home for a year. That’s something I want to do. Ooh. Out of a motor home for a whole year. That’s I want to do with my kids, but I want to do it just my wife.

Josh: 00:58:04 Yeah, I understand that entirely. Uh, how many more books do you think you’ll write over your lifetime?

David: 00:58:11 30.

Josh: 00:58:11 30 more bucks. Wow. All right. We got a whole ton of books to come from you. That’s awesome. All right, last question that I’ve got. I asked this to everyone on the program. It’s the last question that we always end with. Um, and I deliberately do not tell you it beforehand because I just want the kind of the, the raw unfiltered, you know, whatever comes to your mind in this. Fast forward to the end of your life. You’re on your death bed and everything that you’ve done, the money that you’ve made, the impact that you have, it’s all gone. Uh, however, every single person that you’ve touched and impacted either directly or indirectly, you get to leave them with a final message or word of advice, what would that message be?

David: 00:58:46 You’re enough. Hmm. Really just that. Yeah, here enough. I mean we, we, I watch some of the world’s most affluent people still struggling and chasing to fill their hole in their heart with more stuff, with more accolades, with more visible success that were enough.

Josh: 00:59:02 Hmm. Yeah. That’s amazing. That’s super, super powerful. David, thank you so much for your time. Guy Goes, guys, go check out his books. David, any last words from you?

David: 00:59:10 I have pleasure to be here. I just want everyone to know you. You absolutely can do this. There are so many resources for you today that you didn’t have once upon a time. Go for it. Live a great life. Do good stuff through business. And uh, thank you for letting me participate today.

Josh: 00:59:24 Absolutely guys, we will be linking in the book all the descriptions and everything down in the titles down below this. Uh, so make sure to check those out wall. So do an email blast out when the book comes out cause I’m going to be checking it out. And so I appreciate that guys as always, hustle, hustle, God bless. Do not be afraid to think different because those of us that think different are going to be the ones that changed the world. I love you all and I will see you on the next episode. Take it easy fam. Peace.

Outro: 00:59:50 Yo, what’s up guys? You’ve been listening to The Think Different Theory with myself, Josh Forti, which I like to call, “A new paradigm of thinking”, and real quick, I got a question for you. Did you like this episode? If you did, I want to ask a huge favor. See, the biggest thing that helps this podcast grow, and that will spread this message of positivity and making the world a better place, is if you leave a review, a rating and subscribe to the podcast. What that does is, it basically tells the platforms that this is out on, that you like my stuff, and that I’m doing something right. So if you could take like three seconds out of your day and subscribe, leave a rating, and a review, I would be forever grateful for you. Also, I want to hear from you. I want to know your feedback, your ideas, and your questions for future episodes. So be sure to hit me up on Instagram in the DM @JoshForti or via email